SOME/THINGS MAGAZINE » INTERVIEW

黄永砯 HUANG YONG PING / 2001 – 2005 THE BAT PROJECT 蝙蝠计划

mb — Mon, 31 May 2010 00:02:45 +0000

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RLF / SO MANY OF THE TITLES OF YOUR WORKS ARE POETIC WHILE ALSO POSSESSING A PHILOSOPHICAL TONE—HOUSE OF ORACLES, BANK OF SAND, SAND OF BANK, CRANE’S LEGS, DEER’S TRACKS, THE WISE MAN LEARNS FROM THE SPIDER HOW TO SPIN A WEB. IN SOME WAYS, THEY PROVIDE A NAVIGATIONAL KEY FOR ENTERING AND EXPLORING YOUR WORLD. WHAT INSPIRES YOUR TITLES?

HYP / ARTWORKS, BEFORE OR AFTER THEY ARE PRODUCED, ARE ALWAYS CONFUSINGLY DISGUISED BY LANGUAGE, LIKE BEING IN FOG. THE VISIBILITY OF AN ARTWORK, AS IS THE BIRTH OF TEXT, IS INVOLVED WITH LANGUAGE. HOWEVER, THE TITLE OF AN ARTWORK IS NOT ARTWORK. TEXT IS SOMETIMES LIKE A WINDOW THROUGH WHICH ARTWORK REVEALS ITSELF & SOMETIMES A TUNNEL IN WHICH ARTWORK HIDES. IN THE END, ARTWORK IS JUST LIKE TONGS THAT HELP GIVE BIRTH TO BABIES. WHEN YOU LOOK AT ARTWORKS, OR WHEN YOU ARE IN ARTWORKS, YOU CAN THROW IT AWAY.

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RLF / YOU HAVE DESCRIBED THE DISMANTLING OF THE AMERICAN SPY PLANE AS A DECONSTRUCTION OF POWER ITSELF. WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS ON POLITICS & POWER? DOES ART HAVE A POLITICAL POWER?

HYP / COMPARED TO POLITICS & POWER, ART IS JUST A GAME, & IT IS SO INDEED. HOWEVER, IN THE EYES OF ‘GOD’, POLITICS & POWER ARE ALSO OTHER KINDS OF GAMES. BUT THEY ARE NOT TOTALLY IRRELEVANT. ART CAN APPEAR IN POLITICAL EVENTS FROM TIME TO TIME. I USED TO CALL A SPY PLANE AN ARTWORK WHEN IT WAS CUT INTO PIECES & THEN SUBSTITUTED BY ANOTHER PLANE. ACTUALLY SOME EVEN MORE OCCASIONAL & SPECTACULAR POLITICAL EVENTS CAN ALSO BE TAKEN AS ARTWORKS.

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RLF / YOU HAVE MENTIONED THE STRATEGY OF ‘USING THE EAST TO FIGHT THE WEST; USING THE WEST TO FIGHT THE EAST.’ CAN YOU EXPOUND ON THAT NOTION FURTHER?

HYP / ‘USING THE EAST TO FIGHT THE WEST, USING THE WEST TO FIGHT THE EAST’ COMES FROM THE SIXTH STRATEGY OF THE OLD CHINESE MILITARY STRATEGY ‘THIRTY-SIX STRATAGEMS’. I REFERRED TO THIS SENTENCE FOR ITS FLEXIBILITY FOR APPEARING NOW IN THE EAST & THEN IN THE WEST, ITS HIT-&-RUN ATTACKS. EAST & WEST REFER TO WHAT WE CALL THE EAST WORLD & WEST WORLD. ‘MAKING A FEINT TO THE EAST BUT ATTACKING IN THE WEST’ IS A TARGET & A BATTLE FIELD. ‘USING THE EAST TO FIGHT THE WEST, USING THE WEST TO FIGHT THE EAST’ ARE TWO TARGETS & TWO BATTLE FIELDS. IT IS NOT ONLY A STRATEGY BUT ALSO A WAY OF THINKING OF USING DICHOTOMY AGAINST DICHOTOMY. TO DIVIDE THE WORLD INTO EAST & WEST IS DICHOTOMY. BUT COMBINING ‘EAST’ & ‘WEST’ BECOMES A ‘THING/OBJECT,’ SUCH AS A TABLE (IN CHINESE, THE TERM DONGXI, OR EAST WEST, MEANS A GENERAL THING OR OBJECT). IF WE DISMANTLE A TABLE & USE ONE OF THE TABLE LEGS TO HIT ANOTHER ONE, THE OTHER TWO LEGS ARE SPARED TO WAIT & TO WATCH. THAT IS WHY IN CHINESE WE SAY ‘NOT A THING’ WHICH HAS A NEGATIVE MEANING BECAUSE WHEN IT IS ‘NOT A THING’, THE OBJECT IS DESTROYED. WE CAN ALSO SEE EAST & WEST AS POWERS OF SELF-DESTRUCTION. ‘FIGHTING’ MEANS NEITHER WAR NOR DIALOGUE, NEITHER COMMUNICATION NOR SOME HYBRID. ‘FIGHTING’ IS ACTIVELY SEARCH FOR RESOURCES IN ORDER TO SURVIVE.

THE ENTIRE 8 PAGES ARTICLE ON THE BAT PROJECT WITH AN EXCLUSIVE 3 PAGES INTERVIEW BETWEEN HUANG YONG PING & RAINA LAMPKINS-FIELDER ONLY IN THE PRINTED EDITION OF SOME/THINGS MAGAZINE ISSUE002 / THE BLACK BOOK

WAYNE LIU / PAST IS A FOREIGN COUNTRY

mb — Sun, 30 May 2010 23:52:13 +0000

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I CAN’T FULLY DIGEST THE DETAILS OF THE WORLD, BREATHING ITS SMOKE & SMOG, & ALL THE PETTY WHISPERS & PRETTY LIES CIRCULATING IN MY LUNGS ENGULF WHAT’S LEFT OF ME, & IN NO ACT SHALL THE GNAWING SPACE BETWEEN US BE RELIEVED. THE NEGATIVE IMAGES PROJECTED IN THE DARK ROOM ARE MY SILENT QUARRELS WITH THE WORLD, IMPERFECT & PRECARIOUS. I SCRATCH THE SMALLEST SPECKLES OF LIGHT AGAINST THE DISSOLVING SURFACES OF FOGGED & OUT-DATED PHOTOGRAPHIC PAPER, ANTICIPATING THE BLACKS OF MY DESIRE TO REVERSE, LIKE MOTHS WITH THE LIGHTS OUT.

WALKING INTO THE QUAKE AFTERMATH & SEARCHING THROUGH THE ARTIFACTS THAT REMAIN WITH THE LIVING, MY PRESENCE SLIGHTLY FELT THOUGH NOT EFFECTING QUANTITATIVELY THE CONDITIONS IN SIGHT. WE EXIST MERELY IN THE MENAGERIE WE KNOW, & THAT IS ENOUGH, THE FLOOD OF CHANCE, THE RITUALISTIC FIRE, THE AFTERNOON SHADE, & WE MOVE ON, IN MINIATURE ALTERATIONS, EACH TO OUR OWN DISQUIETUDE… THE LONE HIT MAN IN ‘LE SAMOURAÏ’ EXITS THE ROOM, TURNS BACK TO GLANCE, THE CAGED BIRD IS STILL ALIVE. PHOTOGRAPHING IS LIKE CATCHING MOSQUITOES BUZZING CEASELESSLY IN ONE’S DARK ROOM

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ONE MAY CONSIDER CHONGQING IF ONE MAY CHOOSE TO DIE, EXIT THE CABLE CAR OVER THE YANGTZE RIVER, GULPING HER ANCIENT THICK SILT, AWAY PAST BOATMEN WITH CURIOUS EYES. THIS VERTIGO CITY, BUILT UPON MOUNTAINS & ENDLESS STAIRS & IN BETWEEN THE FOOTPATHS, DROPPING US INTO OUR NIGHTS, TRAVERSING FROM HOUSE TO PAVEMENTS SPACKLED WITH BLACKENED SPIT TO GROUND DRILLINGS FOR YET ANOTHER MODERN TOWER TO FOOT MASSAGE PARLORS (THE GIRLS INSIDE WATCHING TELEVISION) FILLED WITH GRILLED CHICKENS & TOSSED AWAY BONES, FUSING BELOW WHAT IS CALLED ONE’S HEAD, & HIGH ABOVE, VAPORS FROM THE RIVER SPIRAL FORTH TOWARDS AN UNKNOWN FUTURE THAT NEON KTV LIGHTS DISGUISE AS INTOXICATION

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THE ENTIRE 16 PAGES ARTICLE WITH THE PHOTOGRAPHS & TEXT BY WAYNE LIU ONLY IN THE PRINTED EDITION OF SOME/THINGS MAGAZINE ISSUE002 / THE BLACK BOOK

15 YEARS OF PINA BAUSCH’S TANZTHEATER WUPPERTAL BY MAARTEN VANDEN ABEELE

mb — Sat, 15 May 2010 12:00:27 +0000

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MONIKA BIELSKYTE / WHAT ARE THE PIECES — NOT ONLY AMONG PINA’S REPERTOIRE — IN THEATER/CHOREOGRAPHY THAT HAVE MOVED YOU MOST DEEPLY?

MVA / MY FAVORITE PIECES FROM PINA ARE PALERMO PALERMO, 1980, SACRE/ DAS FRÜHLINGSOPFER, CAFÉ MÜLLER, TWO CIGARETTES IN THE DARK, TRAUERSPIEL, VIKTOR & DAS STÜCK MIT DEM SHIFF. ABOVE ALL I LIKE THE WAY SHE WORKED AS AN ARTIST, HER LIFE & WORK WERE VERY ORGANICALLY CONNECTED & SHE MANAGED TO DEEPLY UNDERSTAND, RESPECT & WORK WITH LIFE & HUMAN BEINGS IN IT’S ESSENCE. FOR ME WORDS WERE DIFFICULT FOR A LONG TIME. SHE DIDN’T NEED MANY WORDS EITHER TO SAY SOMETHING.
APART FROM PINA ‘S REPERTOIRE THAT SHE CONSTRUCTED OVER THE YEARS I THINK IT IS QUITE DIFFICULT TO FIND THE SAME STRENGTH WITHIN MOST OF THE OTHER COMPANIES. HERE & THERE ARE SOME PIECES THAT STRIKE ME, BUT THERE ARE VERY FEW CHOREOGRAPHERS/THEATER DIRECTORS THAT ACHIEVE TO CREATE SUCH A REPERTOIRE LIKE SHE DID. MOSTLY I LIKE THE PEOPLE I WORK WITH. DA UN ALTRA FACCIA DEL TEMPO FROM JAN FABRE, THE SNAKESONG TRILOGY FROM JAN LAUWERS & GOLLYGOSH NO! FOR A SECOND THERE I THOUGHT I WAS INVOLVED FROM EISBÄR ARE THE PIECES THAT HAVE BEEN IMPORTANT FOR ME.
WHEN I WAS IN KAZUO OHNO’S STUDIO IN TOKYO IN 1999 HE WAS DANCING A DUO WITH HIS SON YOSHITO OHNO TO THE SONG FROM ELVIS PRESLEY ‘I CAN’T HELP FALLING IN LOVE’. THIS WAS FOR ME DEFINITELY A REVELATION. WE (MEMBERS FROM THE TANZTHEATER) COULDN’T HELP IT & WERE JUST WEEPING. HE WAS FOR ME THE TOP PERFORMER &, ACCORDING TO WHAT I SAID ABOUT ASIAN PHILOSOPHY, THE EXAMPLE OF A TREE STANDING IN THE SO FAST CHANGING WORLD.

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MB / DO YOU FEEL THERE IS THE POSSIBILITY TO DISCOVER SOMETHING NEW SEEING PINA’S PIECES MORE THAN ONCE?

MVA / A STAGE PRODUCTION HAS BORDERS & IS FRAMED. MADE TO REPEAT ITSELF AS OFTEN AS IT HAS AN AUDIENCE. REPETITION CAN REDUCE THE RISKS OF THE UNKNOWN, BUT CAN ALSO CHANGE OUR PERCEPTION. THINGS THAT ARE REPEATED FIVE TIMES FOR EXAMPLE ONE CAN REACT, AT FIRST, ASTONISHED, THE SECOND TIME IRRITATED, A THIRD TIME BORED, A FOURTH TIME WONDERING WHY & THE FIFTH TIME WE REOPEN OUR MIND & THINK & MAYBE ACCEPT.

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MB / I CANNOT HELP FINDING MOST OF THE DANCE & THEATER PHOTOGRAPHY SOMEWHAT ONE-DIMENSIONAL, REDUCTORY & OFTEN MERELY ILLUSTRATIVE AS COMPARED WITH THE REAL WORK ON THE STAGE. HOWEVER, WHEN I FIRST DISCOVERED YOUR WORKS I HAD A VERY STRONG IMPRESSION YOU WERE TRYING TO FIND SOMETHING DIFFERENT THAN CONVENTIONAL DANCE PHOTOGRAPHY, AS THERE WAS NOT ONLY THE CAPTURED MOVEMENT OF A DANCE BUT ALSO RELATIONSHIPS BETWEEN THE CHARACTERS & THEIR STORIES, THE EMPTY STAGE & THE SCRATCHES ON THE FLOOR, DUST, SMOKE…

MVA / WHILE PHOTOGRAPHING PINA’S OEUVRE THERE IS NOT ONLY MOVEMENT ON STAGE LIKE IN, LET’S SAY, SWAN LAKE. IT WAS A WHOLE NEW UNIVERSE OF FANTASY OPENING FOR ME. I FELT LIKE I WANTED TO LIVE IN THAT FANTASY WORLD (WHEN I TOLD PINA THIS AT THE TIME YEARS AGO, SHE TOLD ME THAT I SHOULD NEVER FORGET THAT IT’S ‘WORK’ & PROTECTED ME IN THIS WAY FROM LOSING CONTACT WITH REALITY OFF STAGE). THE REPERTOIRE OF HER & THE TANZTHEATER WUPPERTAL IS A VERY RICH – IN A CREATIVE SENSE – WORLD. FOR HER, DANCE COULD BE SO MANY THINGS. SHE LIKED THE THEATER SO MUCH BECAUSE PEOPLE CAN DO THINGS ON STAGE THAT SIMPLY ARE NOT DOABLE IN NORMAL LIFE. PHOTOGRAPHING HER WORK WAS AT THE SAME TIME DISCOVERING PLENTY OF DIFFERENT THINGS & NOT ONLY MOVEMENT OR NON-MOVEMENT

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(EXTRACT OF INTERVIEW BETWEEN MAARTEN VANDEN ABEELE & MONIKA BIELSKYTE)

THE ENTIRE 26 PAGES ARTICLE ON PINA BAUSCH, TANZTHEATER WUPPERTAL & MAARTEN VANDEN ABEELE ONLY IN THE PRINTED EDITION OF SOME/THINGS MAGAZINE ISSUE002 / THE BLACK BOOK

CAI GUO QIANG / RESTRAINED VIOLENCE

mb — Sat, 27 Mar 2010 14:50:01 +0000

THE ENTIRE 12 PAGES ARTICLE WITH AN EXCLUSIVE CAI GUO QIANG INTERVIEW TO RAINA LAMPKINS-FIELDER ONLY IN THE PRINTED EDITION OF SOME/THINGS MAGAZINE ISSUE002 / THE BLACK BOOK

CARLO ZOLLO / OBJET NOIR

admin — Tue, 08 Sep 2009 22:09:38 +0000

THE ENTIRE ARTICLE CAN ONLY BE FOUND IN THE PRINTED EDITION OF SOME/THINGS MAGAZINE ISSUE001

NICOLAS ANDREAS TARALIS / 162 NICOLAS ANDREAS TARALIS / DUSK, ON A HILLTOP SOMEWHERE HIGH & DESOLATELY REMOTE

admin — Sat, 08 Aug 2009 16:10:17 +0000

NICOLAS ANDREAS TARALIS IS WEARING HIS OWN DESIGNS, PHOTOGRAPHED IN HIS ATELIER BY MONIKA BIELSKYTE / PLEASE FIND THE ENTIRE 12 PAGES ARTICLE (9 IMAGES & A BIG INTERVIEW) IS IN THE PRINTED EDITION OF SOME/THINGS MAGAZINE ISSUE001

MICHELE LAMY / THE SINGING PORTRAIT

admin — Thu, 23 Jul 2009 16:20:02 +0000

I WAS HEADING FOR THE FANTASTIC LIGHTS – DESTINY WAS LOOKING AT ME AND NOBODY ELSE – AS IN DYLAN SONG..THIRTY YEARS OF IT – THIRTY YEARS OF ADVENTURES – BUSINESSES – PACIFIC COAST HIGHWAYS – AMERICAN BEAUTY – SUNSET BLVD – BILLY WILDER – TRACTION AVENUE -TOO SOON TO KNOW – FACTORY – SCARLETT ROUGE A MES CÔTÉS – EVERYBODY AT LES DEUX CAFES – AND 20 YEARS OF HUNNYBUNNY’S..HOPE SPRINGS ETERNAL.. ALL HERE WITH US

PLEASE FIND THE WHOLE ARTICLE (16 PAGES WITH 14 IMAGES & THE 4+ PAGES INTERVIEW) WITH MICHELE IN THE PRINTED EDITION OF SOME/THINGS MAGAZINE ISSUE001, IN CONCEPT STORES & SELECTED BOOKSHOPS IN MOST OF THE MAJOR CITIES FROM OR IN SOME/THINGS ONLINE BOUTIQUE

ROGER BALLEN / THE TWIRLING WIRES

admin — Tue, 07 Jul 2009 02:03:24 +0000

MONIKA BIELSKYTE / DREAM & REALITY OVERLAP IN YOUR WORK, & DESPITE THE IMAGE ALL BEING FLASHED IN FOCUS, WE STILL QUITE FEEL IN THE STATE OF NOT YET BEING FULLY AWAKE. THE AUTHENTIC MOMENT IS NOT NECESSARILY THE ONE THAT IS FACTUAL BUT THE ONE THAT IS BELIEVED IN. EVERYTHING SEEMS REAL & INCREDIBLE AT THE SAME TIME, SOMETHING THAT IS PART OF LIFE YET SO RARELY ACHIEVED BY ART. CAN YOU TELL ME MORE ABOUT HOW DO YOUR IMAGES HAPPEN, ABOUT THE PROCESS?

ROGER BALLEN / I NEVER START A PHOTOGRAPH UNTIL I GET TO THE PLACE, I DON’T PLAN A PHOTOGRAPH BEFORE I GO THERE. IT IS IMPOSSIBLE TO PLAN HOW THINGS WOULD COME TOGETHER, IT IS REALLY IMPOSSIBLE TO PREDICT THAT MOMENT WHEN THE PICTURE WORKS. SO I GO THERE & COMPOSE THE PICTURE, I WORK WITH THE PEOPLE, WORK WITH THE PLACE. IT IS AN INTERACTIVE PROCESS, SOMETIMES I TELL SOMEBODY WHAT TO DO, SOMETIMES THEY DO IT, SOMETIMES JUST AS I TELL THEM TO DO IT SOMETHING ELSE HAPPENS, WE WORK IN A SMALL PLACE. NO PICTURE IS EVER THE SAME & I THINK IT IS IMPORTANT TO SEE PHOTOGRAPHY NO DIFFERENT THAN PAINTING – EACH TIME WITH A PHOTOGRAPH IT IS LIKE STARTING WITH A NEW CANVAS & ULTIMATELY THE PHOTOGRAPH IS A PRODUCT OF MY OWN VISION, THE WAY I SEE & THE WAY I COMPOSE REALITY IN FRONT OF ME, LIKE DRAWING WITH LIGHT RATHER THAN DRAWING WITH A PAINTBRUSH

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MB / EXCEPT FOR ‘BOYHOOD’, YOU HAVE ONLY TAKEN IMAGES IN SOUTH AFRICA DESPITE TRAVELING IN ALMOST ALL THE COUNTRIES OF THE CONTINENT, WHY THE DECISION TO NOT EVEN TAKE A CAMERA WHEN SOMEWHERE ELSE?

RB / BECAUSE WHEN I TRAVEL IT’S USUALLY FOR HOLIDAY OR IT’S USUALLY RUNNING HERE, RUNNING THERE. FOR ME PHOTOGRAPHY IS LIKE WRITING PHILOSOPHY, IT TAKES A LOT OF CONCENTRATION, A LOT OF MENTAL PREPARATION – THERE IS NO POINT JUST SNAPPING HERE. MY PICTURES ARE NOT ABOUT SNAPSHOTS – THEY ARE VERY CONCENTRATED MOMENTS, CONCENTRATED EVENTS, WITH COMPLEX MEANINGS TO THEM. IF I AM ON MY WAY TRYING TO CATCH TRAINS & BOATS, & PLANES, & CARRYING LUGGAGE, & HAVING TO GO TO THE MEETINGS, I AM JUST NOT CONCENTRATING ON WHAT I AM DOING. THERE IS NO POINT TO DO TRY & DO SOMETHING IF I CANNOT CONCENTRATE ON IT PROPERLY, THAT ISN’T MY PURPOSE

MB / CAN YOU TELL ME MORE ABOUT THE HITCH-HIKE TRIP YOU IN YOUR YOUTH?

RB / I HAVE ALWAYS THOUGHT THAT WAS ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT THINGS I HAVE DONE IN MY LIFE, BECAUSE I HAVE SPENT 4 & A HALF YEARS DOING THIS TRIP ACROSS THE WORLD, BY MYSELF, WITH VERY LITTLE MONEY AT THAT TIME. IT WAS IN THE 70S, THERE WERE NO CELLPHONES, THERE WERE NO DIGITAL CAMERAS, NO COMPUTERS, THE PHONES DIDN’T WORK. THERE WERE NO PHONES OR PHONES DIDN’T WORK IN AFRICA, & IF YOU WANTED TO MAKE A PHONE CALL YOU MAY HAVE TO WAIT AROUND THE POST OFFICE FOR 5 DAYS TO GET THROUGH ON A LINE. SO YOU KNOW IT’S A DIFFERENT WORLD IN MANY WAYS, & I THINK IT LEFT ME WITH A VERY STRONG UNDERSTANDING OF THE HUMAN CONDITION, I THINK IT GAVE ME A GOOD UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT I THOUGHT OF HUMANITY, OF WHAT HUMANITY WAS, WHO I WAS IN TERMS OF HUMANITY, WHAT ARE HUMANITY’S LIMITS OR WHAT IS THE WHOLE HUMAN LIFE CYCLE ABOUT. I WAS ALWAYS TELLING IN MY MIND THAT EXPERIENCE WAS THE BASIS OF EVERYTHING THAT CAME LATER, IN TERMS OF WHAT I THOUGHT ABOUT HUMAN BEINGS

MB / & CAN YOU TELL ME FROM WHERE TO WHERE DID YOU GO?

RB / FROM CAIRO TO CAPE-TOWN, THAT’S HOW I GOT TO SOUTH AFRICA, BY LAND & THEN FROM ISTAMBUL TO BALI.. BOAT THROUGH PACIFIC, TRIP ACROSS ASIA, IRAN, AFGHANISTAN, PAKISTAN, INDIA, NEPAL, BURMA, THAILAND, MALAYSIA, ALL THE WAY THROUGH ASIA UNTIL PHILIPPINES..

MB / IT COULD BE A WHOLE AMAZING SEPARATE INTERVIEW ON IT ALL..NOW THAT PEOPLE TRAVEL SO MUCH, BUT JUST LIKE TOURISTS, SO SUPERFICIALLY

RB / WELL..YOU COULD SAY THE 70S WEREN’T LIKE THE 30S, & THE 30S WERE NOT LIKE THE 19TH CENTURY.. BUT CERTAINLY THE TECHNOLOGY ISSUES HAVE CHANGED SO MUCH THE WAY WE EXIST IN THIS WORLD TODAY, WITH THE CELLPHONE, COMPUTER, INTERNET.. YOU ARE NEVER ALONE IN THIS WORLD ANYMORE IN A WAY, TECHNOLOGY IS FOLLOWING YOU AROUND & BECOMES LIKE A SHADOW, THAT’S THE DIFFERENCE. I WAS UP IN SUDAN, ABOUT A YEAR AGO, I WAS IN SUDAN, IN THE MIDDLE OF SUDAN & PEOPLE WERE CALLING ME FROM AMERICA, IN THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE, ON CELLPHONE..

MB / & YOU TRAVELED COMPLETELY ALONE FOR THE WHOLE OF THE TRIP?

RB / YEAH, I WAS ALONE, YES. I THINK IT GAVE ME A GREAT SENSE OF BEING ABLE TO GET THINGS DONE BY MYSELF & NOT HAVE OTHER PEOPLE DO THINGS FOR ME

MB / AFTER ALL THE TIME BEING IMMERSED IN THE ENVIRONMENT WHERE VIOLENCE & HARSHNESS BOTH OF THE HUMAN RELATIONSHIPS & NATURE KEEPS ONE VERY MUCH AWARE OF THE TRAGIC/VULNERABLE SIDE OF OUR EXISTENCE, WHAT DO YOU FEEL ABOUT PEOPLE’S PREOCCUPATIONS (AS SEEN IN ART, MEDIA ETC) IN YOUR HOMETOWN NEW YORK & WESTERN WORLD IN GENERAL?

RB / I THINK THE QUALITY OF A LOT OF THE ART WE SEE REFLECTS PEOPLE’S LACK OF EXPERIENCE IN THE PHYSICAL WORLD, IT SHOWS THEIR INABILITY TO DEAL WITH DEEPER ISSUES, &, MORE IMPORTANT, EXISTENTIAL ISSUES THAT WOULD COME ABOUT, THAT THEY WOULD EXPERIENCE IF THEY WERE NOT SO IMMERSED IN MODERN CONTEMPORARY LIFE & SO ADDICTED TO TECHNOLOGY & SHELTERED IN ALL SORTS OF WAYS. & THIS MENTALITY IS EXPRESSED & REFLECTED IN CONTEMPORARY ART BUSINESS, THIS IS WHAT WE SEE.. THE LACK OF QUALITY OF CONTEMPORARY ART ONLY REFLECTS THE INNER WORKINGS OF MOST PEOPLE WHO LO LIVE IN THE CONTEMPORARY SOCIETY, NOT BEING ABLE TO FOCUS ON MORE PROFOUND ISSUES

MB / YOUR WORK, DIFFERENTLY THAN MOST OF THE CONTEMPORARY ART & PHOTOGRAPHY, IS LOOKING LIFE STRAIGHT INTO THE EYE, WITHOUT THE-NOW-SO-POPULAR ESCAPADE INTO DECORATIVE-ISM, CONCEPTIONAL-ISM, EASY ENTERTAINMENT THAT AT THE END ONLY HELPS PEOPLE TO AVOID THINKING ABOUT WHAT IS REALLY HAPPENING IN THIS WORLD &/OR IN THEIR OWN LIVES. YET DESPITE BEING SO UN-CONCESSIONAL YOUR WORK IS IN THE BIGGEST ART GALLERIES & INSTITUTIONS. DO YOU FEEL A STRANGER AMONG IT ALL? WHY DO YOU THINK CONTEMPORARY ART HAS BECOME SO FULL OF PEOPLE’S EGO, VANITY & FAKENESS & ALMOST COMPLETELY DETACHED FROM LIFE’S ISSUES?

RB / I HAVE A VERY DIFFERENT WORK THAN MOST OF ARTISTS FOR ALL SORTS OF REASONS. AS YOU KNOW I AM A TRAINED GEOLOGIST, I HAVE A DOCTORATE IN GEOLOGY, HAVE BEEN A BUSINESSMAN FOR MANY MANY YEARS, AN ARTIST FOR MANY MANY YEARS. I THINK ALWAYS MOST IMPORTANT TO ME IS NOT WORRYING ABOUT WHAT OTHER PEOPLE DO, BUT JUST REALLY TRY TO FOCUS ON WHAT I AM DOING. YOU CAN GO CRAZY IF YOU FOLLOW WHAT IS GOING ON THERE, YOU SEE SO MUCH STUFF THAT IS SO FULL OF PEOPLE’S EGOS, VANITY & FAKENESS, AS YOU SAY IT, YOU CAN ACTUALLY GIVE UP AFTER A WHILE IF YOU PUT YOURSELF IN THIS SITUATION ALL THE TIME & TRY TO IDENTIFY WITH WHAT IS OUT THERE. I TRY NOT TO GET MYSELF INVOLVED IN IT ALL & I THINK THE ONE THING THAT I HAVE PROBABLY BEEN LUCKY ABOUT, THOUGH I DON’T KNOW IF LUCKY IS THE RIGHT WORD, WAS LIVING IN SOUTH AFRICA. FOR ALL THESE YEARS I HAVE BEEN REALLY PRETTY FAR AWAY FROM ALL THOSE THINGS, THERE IS NOT MUCH OF THE CONTEMPORARY OR A SCENE HERE, CERTAINLY MOST OF THE YEARS I HAVE BEEN LIVING HERE, THERE WAS ALMOST NO CONTEMPORARY ART SCENE, THERE ARE ISSUES OF CONTEMPORARY LIFE HERE TO THE SAME DEGREE, BUT THE ART BUSINESS & ART WORLD HERE IS VERY VERY SMALL, I SPEND A LOT OF MY TIME HERE, IT’S NOT LIKE LIVING IN PARIS OR NEW YORK WHERE YOU ARE JUST IN IT & IT’S JUST ONE THING AFTER THE NEXT AFTER THE NEXT AFTER THE NEXT, HERE IT’S ON MUCH MUCH SMALLER SCALE, IT ENABLED ME TO JUST FOCUS ON MY WORK, NOT HAVE TO COMPARE MYSELF WITH OTHER PEOPLE, JUST FOCUS ON WHAT I HAVE BEEN DOING ALL THESE YEARS

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MB / YOUR MAIN MEDIUM IS BOOKS, CAN YOU TELL ME MORE ABOUT IT?

MB / MY GOAL IN ALL MY PROJECTS YEAR AFTER YEAR HAVE BEEN BOOKS, MOST OF THEM TAKE ME 4 TO 5 YEARS & THE BOOK IS REALLY MY END RESULT OF ALL THE WORK DONE DURING THIS PERIOD, I REALLY AM BOOK ORIENTATED RATHER THAN EXHIBITION ORIENTATED. IT IS VERY IMPORTANT TO BE ABLE TO START SOMETHING & FINISH SOMETHING, A LOT OF PEOPLE START SOMETHING BUT THEY DON’T FINISH IT. IF I WORK ON SOMETHING FOR 4 OR 5 YEARS IT IS TO MAKE IT INTEGRATED, A VERY DIFFICULT TASK, BUT ALSO VERY INSPIRING, YOU LEARN A LOT; CREATING SOMETHING IS LIKE CREATING A LIFE ON ITS OWN ALMOST, IT’S A REAL CHALLENGE TO DO THESE THINGS & SEE THEM THROUGH WHEN YOU ACTUALLY FINISH IT

MB / FOR YEARS YOU HAVE WORKED AS A GEOLOGIST & YOU STILL PRACTICE IT NEXT TO YOUR ARTISTIC WORK. WHAT MADE YOU DECIDE TO TAKE ON THIS PROFESSION BACK IN TIME & WHAT STILL FASCINATES YOU ABOUT IT TO KEEP DOING IT WHEN THERE IS NO MORE FINANCIAL NECESSITY?

RB / WHEN I WAS YOUNGER I ALWAYS LIKED BEING IN NATURE & EVEN TODAY NATURE FOR ME IS THE HIGHEST LEVEL INSPIRATION, PROBABLY YOU DON’T FEEL THAT MUCH OF IT AMONG CONTEMPORARY ARTISTS, BUT FOR ME THERE HAS NEVER BEEN ANY OTHER ISSUE ABOUT IT. GEOLOGY BROUGHT ME CLOSE TO NATURE, I ENJOYED THAT PROFESSION & THOUGHT IT WAS MY CHALLENGE TO FIND GOLD & DIAMONDS, OR COPPER, OR COAL, I ENJOYED BEING IN DIFFERENT PLACES IN AFRICA. IT WAS A REALLY ENJOYABLE JOB BECAUSE I LIKE BEING IN NATURE & I ENJOY A CHALLENGE OF FINDING THINGS, SO I THOUGHT IT REALLY INTERESTING & INTERACTIVE ENVIROMENT, IT GAVE ME A GOOD BALANCE WITH THE PHOTOGRAPHY I WAS DOING. I WAS REALLY LUCKY TO LIKE MY CAREER, I WAS ALWAYS MY OWN BOSS, BECAUSE IT ENABLED ME TO DO PHOTOGRAPHY – I DIDN’T WORK FOR ANYBODY, I HAD MY OWN TIME & I COULD DO MY OWN THING. THAT WAS A VERY CRUCIAL POINT FOR ME, THAT I WAS ACTUALLY ABLE TO HAVE AN INDEPENDENCE FROM OTHER PEOPLE & DO MY PHOTOGRAPHY, YEAR AFTER YEAR ON MY OWN TIME

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MB / IT IS ALL SO MUCH ABOUT TRACES IN YOUR WORK; DRAWINGS & CREAKS ON THE WALLS, WIRES IN THE MOST IMPROBABLE FORMS, THEY ARE ALMOST LIKE CHARACTERS THEMSELVES IN YOUR IMAGES. CAN YOU TELL ME MORE ABOUT IT? & ABOUT SO MANY THINGS THAT ARE BEHIND THE CURTAIN, BEHIND THE SURFACE, BEHIND THE SHOT. IS IT HARDER TO CHOOSE WHAT WILL BE IN THE IMAGE OR WHAT TO LEAVE OUT?

RB / I THINK YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT ABOUT THAT. I THINK PEOPLE TOO OFTEN JUST ASK ME ABOUT THE PEOPLE IN THE PLACE, THEY DON’T LOOK AT THE FINER DETAILS IN THE PICTURES. ESPECIALLY IN THE BOARDING HOUSE, THERE IS A TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF DETAIL TO LOOK AT & I THINK EACH ONE OF THESE THINGS, AS YOU SAY, ARE CHARACTERS IN THEMSELVES, THE IMAGES IN THEMSELVES, HAVE THEIR OWN INNER NEEDINGS. THEY ARE ALL PART OF THE PICTURE & EVERYTHING IN THE PICTURE EQUALS EVERYTHING ELSE IN THE PICTURE, I THINK IT IS AN IMPORTANT POINT TO UNDERSTAND THAT ALL THESE THINGS YOU SEE HAVE AN EQUAL IMPORTANCE, THEY ARE ALL THERE TO INTEGRATE WITH EVERYTHING ELSE, TO CREATE A HIGHER LEVEL RELATIONSHIP – IF YOU TAKE ONE THING OUT THEN THE WHOLE THING DOESN’T WORK SO WELL. IT IS AN INTEGRATED ARTISTIC VISION THAT YOU SEE – USING DRAWINGS, USING PEOPLE, USING ANIMALS, USING PAINTINGS, USING SCULPTURE, USING TEXTURE, USING LINES, USING SHADOW, USING LIGHT – ALL THESE THINGS INTERACT INSIDE THE PICTURE LAYER ON LAYER ON LAYER, I THINK IT IS NOT A MATTER OF CHOOSING WHAT WILL BE IN THE IMAGE OR WHAT WILL BE OUT, THE PROBLEM IS TO INTEGRATE THINGS TO CREATE A HIGHER LEVEL MEANING, I THINK THAT IS THE HARD PART

MB / & THAT’S WHAT I FEEL IS SO DIFFERENT & SO FASCINATING ABOUT YOUR WORK

RB / THAT IS REALLY THE CHALLENGE TO INTEGRATE ALL THOSE THINGS INTO A COMMON REALITY.. IT HAS TAKEN ME 40-50 YEARS OF DOING THIS YEAR AFTER YEAR AFTER YEAR, TO INTEGRATE MORE & MORE THINGS IN THIS SIMPLE COMMENT ON REALITY, THAT IS THE HARD POINT. I ALWAYS COMPARE THAT TO JOGGLING, IT IS EASY TO THROW ONE OR 2 BALLS IN THE AIR, BUT TRY THROWING 8, 9 OR 10 – YOU WILL SEE HOW HARD IT IS – & THAT IS THE ISSUE HERE

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MB / CAN YOU TELL ME MORE ABOUT SHADOW CHAMBER, THE PLACE?

RB / THE SHADOW CHAMBER WAS A BUILDING IN THE EASTERN SIDE OF JOHANNESBURG, AN OLD MINING BUILDING, 3 FLOORS, 2 FLOORS IN THE BASEMENT. IT WAS BUILT IN THE TURN OF THE CENTURY, IT WAS A LONG BUILDING, A BUILDING WHO HAD LONG LONG LONG HALLWAYS & OF THE SIDES OF THE HALLWAYS, SMALL ROOMS LIKE CHAMBERS. I SPENT 4 YEARS IN THIS BUILDING PHOTOGRAPHING THE PEOPLE OF THE SHADOW CHAMBER, IT WAS AN OLD BUILDING THAT PEOPLE STAYED IN.. IN SEPTEMBER 2004 THEY TORE THE BUILDING DOWN

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MB / & ABOUT BOARDING HOUSE, THE PLACE YOU HAVE CREATED OF IT? IS IT MORE A REAL PLACE OR A PLACE WHERE ONE’S DREAMS ARE COMING FROM?

RB / I THINK WHAT IS REAL IN THE BOARDING HOUSE IS BOARDING HOUSE THE BOOK. IF YOU WENT TO THE BOARDING HOUSE & SPENT 5 YEARS & MADE A BOOK OF IT, IT WOULDN’T BE THE SAME BOARDING HOUSE THAT I CREATED. THE BOARDING HOUSE IS MY PICTURES THAT ARE PUT TOGETHER & NOW IT IS CALLED BOARDING HOUSE, I THINK THAT’S WHAT YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND, IT IS NOT AN ISSUE WHETHER IT IS A REAL PLACE OR A DREAM PLACE. IT IS ABOUT INTERACTING IN A PLACE TO CREATE A VISION OF THE WORLD THAT I HAVE CALLED THE BOARDING HOUSE & WHETHER IT IS A REAL PLACE OR NOT IT DOESN’T MATTER; IT IS A VERY COMPLEX ISSUE BUT PEOPLE DO NOT SEEM TO UNDERSTAND

MB / HOW DIFFERENT IT IS FOR YOU TO WORK IN JOHANNESBURG, FROM YOUR PREVIOUS WORKS IN COUNTRYSIDE?

RB / I THINK THE MOST IMPORTANT THING WORKING IN JOHANNESBURG IS THAT I CAN WORK 5 OR 6 AFTERNOONS A WEEK NOW. I GET IN MY CAR & WITHIN 15 MINUTES START TAKING PICTURES, WHEREAS THE COUNTRYSIDE WAS ENDLESS DRIVING HERE TO THERE & I HAD TO COME HOME, SOMETIMES SPEND 2-3 WEEKS AT HOME & THEN I HAD TO LEAVE AGAIN – IT WAS REALLY REALLY DIFFICULT TO GO BACK & FORTH ALL THE TIME. JOHANNESBURG IS A BIG CITY, BUT I DON’T NEED TO DO MUCH DRIVING AROUND, AS YOU COULD SEE IN THE SHADOW CHAMBER & BOARDING HOUSE I NOW WORK IN VERY SIMILAR PLACES, I DON’T NEED TO TRAVEL ALL OVER THE CITY EVERY DAY BECAUSE I HAVE FOUND PLACES TO WORK IN & I STAY THERE, WHEREAS IN THE COUNTRYSIDE I USED TO GO FROM ONE VILLAGE TO THE NEXT VILLAGE TO THE NEXT VILLAGE – IT IS A DIFFERENT WAY TO PHOTOGRAPH. NOW IT IS MORE ABOUT FINDING ONE OR 2 PLACES & SPENDING YEARS & YEARS THERE RATHER THAN TRYING TO FIND SOMEBODY IN ONE PLACE & THEN GOING TO THE NEXT PLACE – I THINK THAT IS THE MAIN DIFFERENCE; I HAVE PRODUCED A LOT MORE PHOTOGRAPHS THIS WAY, DOING WORK EVERY DAY

/../

MB / ‘THE TWIRLING WIRES’ IS ONE OF THE MOST POWERFUL IMAGES I HAVE EVER SEEN. MAKES ME THINK OF A HURRICANE, OR OF A WHOLE WORLD DESCENDING UPON A MAN, OR MAYBE RATHER THE WORLD INSIDE US, BIGGER THAN OUR OWN SELVES, BEAUTY & TERROR, SOMETHING THAT WE CANNOT COMPREHEND & ARE NEVER ABLE TO PUT INTO WORDS. YOU HAVE WRITTEN ME A BIT ABOUT THE MAN IN THAT IMAGE, THAT YOU HAVE PHOTOGRAPHED HIM ALMOST IMMEDIATELY AFTER YOU SAW HIM & THAT YOU HAVE LEARNED SEVERAL WEEKS LATER THAT HE WAS FOUND DEAD IN THAT VERY SAME PLACE. WHAT DID YOU FEEL THEN? WHAT DOES THAT IMAGE MEAN TO YOU NOW?

RB / I ALWAYS SAY MOST IMPORTANT IMAGES ARE THE ONES THAT I DON’T UNDERSTAND, BUT THAT REVEAL SOMETHING ABOUT MYSELF. TWIRLING WIRES FOR ME IS A VERY PROFOUND IMAGE, VERY POWERFUL IMAGE, IT’S ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT IMAGES I EVER TOOK. WHEN I LOOK AT TWIRLING WIRES IT ALWAYS GIVES ME SOMETHING, ALWAYS SAYS SOMETHING ABOUT MY LIFE & ALWAYS INSPIRES ME IN SOME WAYS, I WANT TO LOOK AT THAT PICTURE BECAUSE IT REALLY ACHIEVES SOMETHING, SOMETHING THAT STICKS WITH ME, I WISH I COULD TAKE MORE PICTURES LIKE THAT. IT HAS ALWAYS GIVEN ME THAT, SO I AM NEVER TIRED OF IT. A GOOD PHOTOGRAPH LIVES, A GOOD PHOTOGRAPH LIVES BEYOND THE ARTIST, & THAT IS AN IMPORTANT THING, & NOT NECESSARILY MY RELATIONSHIP TO THAT PERSON OR THAT PLACE; I THINK MOST IMPORTANT THING IS THE PHOTOGRAPH, WHAT IS IT SAYING, WHAT IS IT REVEALING, THAT’S THE KEY THING, THAT IT CONTINUALLY GIVES PEOPLE THE MESSAGE, WHEREVER THEY ARE, OVER THE TIME, THAT’S THE CRITERIA. NOT LIKE THAT CONTEMPORARY ART IDEA THAT YOU HAVE TO READ ABOUT IT BEFORE YOU CAN UNDERSTAND, IN A LOT OF CONTEMPORARY ART YOU LOOK AT THESE THINGS & YOU HAVE NO UNDERSTANDING AT ALL WHAT ANYTHING IS ABOUT, SO YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO READ ABOUT THEM, BUT WHEN YOU READ ABOUT THEM, IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH WHAT YOU SEE – THAT IS NOT MY IDEA ABOUT GOOD ART

/../

MB / IS THERE SOMETHING THAT ARE YOU TRYING TO TRANSMIT VIA YOUR IMAGES? OR IS IT SOMETHING YOU ARE TRYING TO UNDERSTAND /FIND THROUGH THEM & THROUGH THE PROCESS, YOURSELF?

RB / I AM NOT TRYING TO TRANSMIT ANYTHING, I JUST DO MY WORK.. I DON’T HAVE GOALS, I DON’T SAY OH MY PICTURES ARE ABOUT THIS OR MY PICTURES ARE ABOUT THAT, THEY ARE ONLY ABOUT MY LIFE ON THE PLANET, MY RELATIONSHIP TO THE THINGS ON THIS PLANET, I DON’T HAVE ANYTHING TO PROVE, MY LIFE IS MY LIFE, IT IS NOT ABOUT ONE THING OR THE OTHER. I AM JUST TRYING TO UNDERSTAND MY LIFE, THAT’S ALL I AM TRYING TO DO – TRYING TO HAVE A BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF MY SHORT LIFE ON THE PLANET, WHAT IS IT ALL ABOUT, WHO AM I. IT IS ALL THAT I AM TRYING, ACTUALLY IT’S THE ONLY PURPOSE OF WHAT I AM DOING. HOPEFULLY THOSE PICTURES WILL ALSO HAVE SOME IMPACT ON OTHER PEOPLE, HOPEFULLY THEY WILL MAKE A POSITIVE CONTRIBUTION TO THE HUMAN EXISTENCE & HUMAN ENDEAVOR, IN SOME WAY

UPCOMING EXHIBITIONS BY ROGER HAMILTON’S GALLERY LONDON COTOBER 2009 / MILAN TRIENALLE OCTOBER NOVEMBER 2009 / GAGOSIAN GALLERY NEW YORK NOVEMBER DECEMBER 2009 / KAMEL MENNOUR GALLERY PARIS JANUARY FEBRUARY 2010

THE ENTIRE ARTICLE (THE ENTIRE 3 PAGES INTERVIEW, 16 IMAGES OF WHICH 5 NEVER PREVIOUSLY PUBLISHED & 3+ PAGES INTERVIEW) ONLY IN THE PRINTED EDITION OF SOME/THINGS MAGAZINE ISSUE001

ZHANG HUAN / WORLD IN THE TEMPLE IS A WORLD OF HOPES

admin — Wed, 06 May 2009 11:06:13 +0000

MONIKA BIELSKYTE / YOUR NEW SCULPTURAL/INSTALLATION WORKS (SUCH AS BUDDHA FINGER) STRIKE ME BY THE FEELING OF A LOSS SPECTATOR EXPERIENCES LOOKING AT THEM. HOW IMPORTANT THE EXPERIENCE OF MISSING IS FOR YOU? CAN YOU MAYBE TELL ME MORE ABOUT THINGS THAT (NOT ONLY IN YOUR WORK, BUT ALSO IN THE WORLD AS YOU SEE IT) ARE PRESENT THROUGH THEIR ABSENCE?

ZHANG HUAN / 当我在拉萨看到这些残件时，有一种神秘的力量在感动着我，它们自身带有一种历史痕迹和生命信仰，象人的肢体一样。这与生活经历有关，车祸可使人残废，暴力可使你的头颅打开，战争会让无数无辜人失去生命，灾难使人家破人亡、妻离子散。这些残件无法不让我思考人类本身。

WHEN I SAW THESE FRAGMENTS IN LHASA, I WAS MOVED BY A KIND OF MYSTICAL FORCE. THEY THEMSELVES CARRY VESTIGES OF HISTORY AND A BELIEF IN LIFE, LIKE THE HUMAN BODY. THIS IS RELATED TO ONE’S LIFE EXPERIENCE: A TRAFFIC ACCIDENT MAY LEAD TO A DISABILITY, VIOLENCE MAY CRACK YOUR SKULL OPEN, MANY LIVES ARE LOST IN WAR, YOUR FAMILY MAY END IN CALAMITY. THESE FRAGMENTS MAKE ME THINK ABOUT BEING HUMAN

MB / BUDDHA FINGER WORKS MAKE ME THINK OF THE SKY BURIAL IN TIBET, I KNOW YOU HAVE SEEN IT YOURSELF SOME TIME AGO, WHAT EXPERIENCE WAS IT FOR YOU?

ZH/ 如果我能选择死亡的方式，我将选择西藏的“天葬”。
IF I COULD CHOOSE MY THE WAY OF DYING, I WOULD CHOOSE THE SKY BURIAL IN TIBET

MB / YOU HAVE SAID EARLIER IN YOUR LIFE, WHILE YOU WAS STILL DOING PERFORMANCE WORKS, THAT BODY IS THE LANGUAGE & THAT ANY OTHER LANGUAGE ELSE IS TOO REMOVED FROM LIFE EXPERIENCE. NOW, THAT YOUR WORK FORMALLY SEEMS SO DIFFERENT I STILL FEEL THAT BODY IS THE MAIN LANGUAGE FOR YOU, THOUGH NOT ONLY THE HUMAN – YOUR BODY, BUT ALSO THE ‘BODY’ OF ASH, ‘BODY’ OF THE VISION (BUDDHA IMAGES) ETC, WHAT DO YOU FEEL ABOUT IT NOW?
ZH / 你说的很对。
YOU ARE RIGHT

MB / I HAVE AN IMPRESSION THAT YOU, DIFFERENTLY THAN MOST CONTEMPORARY ARTISTS TODAY, CREATE WORKS NOT NECESSARILY FOR THE FINAL RESULT, BUT MORE AS A RITUAL. WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT IT; WHAT IS THE SIGNIFICANCE OF THE RITUAL FOR YOU?

ZH / 在作品过程中我努力要体验的是生存，身体和真实，而厌恶作品中的表演成份。
DURING THE PROCESS OF MAKING ART, WHAT I TRY TO EXPERIENCE IS EXISTENCE, BODY AND REALITY. I HATE THE “PERFORMATIVE ASPECT” IN THE WORKS

MB / SEARCHING FOR THE MEANING?
ZH / 我只关心我个人的生存状态，心理状态，我只关心我的生活。无为而无不为。
I JUST CARE ABOUT MY PERSONAL LIVING CONDITIONS, MENTAL STATE AND MY LIFE. (TAO)NEVER DOES, YET THROUGH IT EVERYTHING IS DONE (THIS SENTENCE IS FROM THE WISDOM OF LAO TSE)

MB / CAN YOU TELL ME MORE ABOUT TIBET & HOW YOU SEE ITS PEOPLE’S TRADITION OF THE PILIGRIMAGE? THE IMAGES IN YOUR MEMORY OF IT THAT SEEM MOST POWERFUL & DO YOU FEEL IT HAS AFFECTED YOUR WAY TO SEE THE WORLD & TO CREATE?

ZH / 西藏的特殊地理环境产生了西藏人，产生了西藏文化。强撼的高原地理与气候的背后，有种超自然的魔力。藏民面对恶魔般的自然下，使人窒息和难以生存。藏民不得不寻求一个更强大能与自然抗衡的英雄，这个英雄就是佛。藏民对生的意义就是死亡，对死亡的意义就是再生。藏民为了获得再生用两年时间从自己的山村出发，徒步扣着长头奔向圣地布达拉宫。
THE SPECIAL GEOGRAPHICAL FEATURES OF THE AREA HAVE GIVEN RISE TO THE TIBETAN PEOPLE AND TIBETAN CULTURE. THERE IS A SUPERNATURAL MAGIC BEHIND ITS INCREDIBLE HIGHLAND GEOGRAPHY AND WEATHER. BECAUSE THIS HELLISH/NATURAL ENVIRONMENT TAKES THE BREATH AWAY AND MAKES IT HARD TO LIVE, TIBETAN PEOPLE HAVE TO LOOK FOR A MIGHTY HERO WHO CAN DEFEND THEM AGAINST NATURE, THIS HERO IS BUDDHA. TO THE TIBETAN PEOPLE, BIRTH MEANS DEATH, DEATH MEANS REBIRTH. IN ORDER TO GAIN NEW LIFE, TIBETAN PEOPLE LEAVE THEIR VILLAGE FOR TWO YEARS AND TRAVEL TO THE POTALA PALACE ON FOOT, KNEELING DOWN AND KOWTOWING ALL THE WAY

MB / 关于你作品里的历史的痕迹 TRACES OF HISTORY IN YOUR WORKS?

ZH / 生命是一个轮回的过程，我想表达和记录这个过程。
LIFE IS A PROCESS OF SAMSARA. I WANT TO EXPRESS AND RECORD THIS PROCESS

MB / 艺术的限制？LIMITS OF ART?

ZH / 艺术没有止境，关键是你的头脑不能有止境。
THERE ARE NO LIMITS IN THE FIELD OF ART, IF ONLY THERE ARE NO LIMITS IN YOUR MIND. HISTORY CAN BE BORROWED, ALTERED AND REIMAGINED BY ONESELF. IT REMINDS ME OF A SONG THAT WAS OFTEN SUNG BY PEOPLE WHEN I WAS YOUNG, WITH THE WORDS: ‘TO LIFT YOUR SWORD ABOVE THE HEADS OF THE DEVILS.’ BUT IN MY OPINION, THIS SENTENCE SHOULD BE REWRITTEN AS ‘TO LIFT THE SWORD ABOVE OUR HEADS OURSELVES’, UNTIL OUR DEATH’

MB / 对你来讲，在生活中什么是最真实的？WHAT IS FOR YOU LIFE AT ITS MOST REAL?

ZH / 吃喝拉撒睡呼吸。
EATING, DRINKING, SHITTING, PEEING, AND BREATHING

MB / 香灰？ASH?

ZH / 香灰对我来讲不是材料，她是一种集体记忆，集体灵魂，集体思考，集体祝福。去寺院的善男善女们，有的祈求早得贵子，有的祈求家人平安，有的祈求早日康复，有的祈求来年好运发大财，有的祈求熬过难关、告别贫困、事业顺利。寺院里完全是另外一种希望世界，医院里则是另一种面对痛苦和死亡的挣扎世界。
TO ME ASH IS NOT A MATERIAL, BUT SOMETHING THAT EXPRESS A GROUP SOUL: COLLECTIVE MEMORY, COLLECTIVE BLESSINGS AND COLLECTIVE COLLAPSE. PEOPLE GO TO TEMPLE PRAYING TO BUDDHA TO GIVE THEM OFFSPRING, OR PRAYING PEACE FOR FAMILY MEMBERS. SOME PEOPLE PRAY FOR SICK PEOPLE TO GET WELL SOON, SOME FOR GOOD LUCK AND MAKE A FORTUNE IN THE COMING YEAR. OR THEY ARE PEOPLE WHO WANT TO WEATHER THE STORM, STAY AWAY FROM POVERTY, WISHES A SUCCESSFUL CAREER OR BUSINESS. IT IS TOTALLY ANOTHER HOPEFUL WORLD IN TEMPLE, WHILE IT IS A STRUGGLING WORLD OF SUFFERING AND DEATH IN HOSPITAL

MB / 时间？ TIME?

ZH / 时间一秒一秒地给我们，所以要一秒一秒的用。
TIME PASSES SECOND BY SECOND; SO IT SHOULD BE USED SECOND BY SECOND

MB / 重生？REBIRTH?

ZH / 轮回转世与因果报应是密切相连的，也许上世我是一头驴转世过来的，来世可能又是一头驴。我不知道，全靠我的造化了。孩子是生命的连续，人死后49天才能真离开人间。
SAMSARA AND REBIRTH ARE TIGHTLY TIED TO CAUSE AND EFFECT (YIN AND GUO). MAYBE I WAS A DONKEY MY PAST LIFE, AND MAYBE I WILL BE A DONKEY AGAIN IN THE AFTERLIFE. I HAVE NO IDEA, IT ALL DEPENDS ON MY LUCK. CHILDREN ARE A CONTINUATION OF LIFE. PEOPLE TRULY LEAVE THIS WORLD 49 DAYS AFTER DEATH

THE ENTIRE 12 PAGES ARTICLE WITH ZHANG HUAN IN THE PRINTED EDITION OF SOME/THINGS MAGAZINE ISSUE001

MARIE BOVO / BAB EL LOUK 5H45-23H36

admin — Mon, 16 Mar 2009 19:07:47 +0000

05h45 BAB-EL-LOUK

18H50 BAB-EL-LOUK

19H50 BAB-EL-LOUK

21H20 BAB-EL-LOUK

23H36 BAB-EL-LOUK

MONIKA / the main thing i wanted to talk about with you is your personal relation to that cityscape in your images, bab-el-louk, not necessarily the real place in cairo, but rather the one that it has become in your heart, in your memory?

MARIE / Sorry, I will answer in french, it’s easer for me. Le Caire…Je voudrais dire une première chose sur cette ville. Une chose très personnelle, je suis très heureuse dans cette ville. Très heureuse physiquement, je me sens chez moi, si pour autant être chez soi c’est habiter une partie de son enfance. Pourtant ce n’est pas une ville facile, ce n’est pas une ville facile et ce n’est pas une ville très tendre avec les femmes
Mais si je reviens en arrière dans les diverses choses qui ont présidées à cette série Bab-El-Louk, Le premier point est le fait que j’avais commencé une collaboration sur un projet autour de la “Divine Comédie” de Dante avec Kadhim Jihad, qui est le traducteur en arabe littéraire cette oeuvre. J’avais rencontré en 2004 Kadhim qui est irakien, un immense traducteur qui vit en exil à Paris et lui avait proposé de travailler ensemble sur l’Enfer et le Paradis à partir de sa traduction. Donc à partir du “texte arabe de Dante”. Cet aller-retour d’une rive à l’autre de la Méditerranée, d’un texte chrétien à sa traduction arabe occupait complètement mon esprit, définissait déjà un mode de perception. J’étais, avant même d’être au Caire, quelque part entre l’Enfer et le Paradis, entre la chute et l’envol. Et Le Caire c’était ça, à la fois une ville réelle et une ville dans laquelle tout pouvait se réaliser, les mythes anciens, l’attentat le plus sordide et la rencontre avec l’Ange
Lorsque j’ai séjourné au Caire pour travailler sur la série Bab-El-Louk, j’y étais en famille avec ma fille qui avait sept ans et son père. Ma fille m’accompagnait très souvent dans nos promenades dans le quartier de Bab-El-Louk et c’était magique. Magique, parce qu’elle était un enfant! Il y avait un état de grace, tout le monde lui parlait, dans la rue on s’adressait constamment à elle en anglais ou en arabe, on disait un mot gentil, offrait un gateau, un thé. J’attends encore le “hello Baby” lorsqu’on s’adressait à elle. En même temps lorsque nous voulions prendre un verre, les cafés nous étaient fermés, parce que l’on voyait bien qu’il n’y avait pas de femmes à l’intérieur. On avait d’ailleurs finit par trouver une patisserie qui faisait office de salon de thé dans laquelle on voyait des femmes, des couples, c’était d’ailleurs le lieu de rendez-vous des amoureux; on le sentait à leur nervosité d’être ensemble. Des lieux mixtes, il y a en pas beaucoup au Caire, sans parler biensûr des bars des hotels internationnaux, mais je parle de la mixité de la rue, de la mixité dans un quartier très populaire. Là c’est different. Il y a ségrégation, homme et femme de part et d’autres, à part cette patisserie!

MONIKA / also, despite knowing cairo quite well i cannot help somehow seeing a quite disturbing correlation between your images & images (in my head) of palestine, the gaza strip..is it something that feels strange for you as a thought? what do you feel about it yourself?

MARIE/ You are not the first one who does this connection between the photo i did in Cairo and Palestine, Gaza strip. Je vais répondre différemment, j’ai beaucoup lu la poésie de Mahmoud Darwich et je fais mienne sa géographie. Autrement dit si Le Caire peut-évoquer la Palestine, La bande de Gaza, est-ce si étonnant, est-ce si étrange? Ne sommes nous pas dans la même région, dans la contiguïté historique et politique? Je pense que la réponse à cette question n’est pas dans la similitude, mais dans le coeur! Une ville comme Le Caire échappe à toute description, elle est une métaphore en soi! Comme dans les histoires Jose Luis Borges : un labyrinthe du temps et de l’espace, On y croise physiquement à certaines heures du jour ou de la nuit, la Palestine dévastée, la guerre, les Jardins de l’Alhambra ou de Baghdad. Le Caire avec la beauté en plus, la pauvreté, la densité, la pollution, la saturation, cernée par des ‘autoroutes touristiques’, par la pression des fondamentalismes religieux, Le Caire ne se résume pas à une seule ville. En tous cas c’est comme cela que je l’ai photographiée

MONIKA / ..& babelouk as babel?

MARIE / Oui, Bab-El-Louk, comment ne pas entendre Babel dans le nom même! Babel, la Tour censée atteindre le ciel, la grande citée universelle qui contenait en elle toute l’humanité mais qui fut ruinée par le châtiment divin. Oui, quand on voit les terrasses du quartier de Bab-El-Louk, comment ne pas penser aux peintures de la renaissance qui montrent une tour de Babel à moitié construite à moitié détruite. Il y a une similitude frappante entre l’imaginaire du mythe et la réalité de la ville. Comme si précisément, c’était ce processus de Tour de Babel qui était à l’oeuvre dans la ville du Caire, la construction et la destruction étant la continuité d’un même état qui oscille entre les deux pôles. Mais peut-être peut -on voir dans les toits terrasses propres aux villes arabes et à certaines villes du sud de l’Espagne, une survivance du mythe, une manière d’être entre le ciel et la terre entre le sol, la rue, l’espace public et le toit, le ciel, l’intime. Le mythe de Babel renvoie très clairement à la genèse, aux commencements, à une dimension universelle. Et il n’y a pas de doute que le Caire est une dimension universelle, parce que c’est une ville qui est traversée par le temps comme par l’histoire et que l’identité arabe va de paire avec l’identité méditerranéenne

MONIKA / can you tell me about sounds, words, people, smell, all those somethings that had to remain behind the shot, that were not captured physically but memory of which is the soul pattern of these images?

MARIE / Of course sound! A photo is silent! Et la ville du Caire c’est du son, c’est un choeur ininterrompu de klaxon de tous styles, de toutes modulations, de toutes intensité. Une rumeur de circulation, de paroles qui est présente tout le jour, qui semble matte, écrasée quand le soleil brûle la ville puis qui gonfle vers le soir jusqu’à devenir de plus en plus assourdissante la nuit comme si ça n’allait jamais s’arrêter. Et au milieu de tout cela, les appels à la prière, relayés par des dizaines et des dizaines de haut parleurs, plus ou moins beaux ou mécaniques selon qu’ils sont lancés par un muezzin ou un enregistrement. Ces appels à la prière rythment chaque journée, parce qu’il correspondent à des horaires précis, à un déroulement et à un sens du temps. La Salat, l’appel à la prière à des temps déterminés c’est aussi ce qui a fait que la série de Bab-El-Louk, s’est construite sur l’idée d’une journée comme unité de temps qui définit tout un cycle. Chaque heure désigne une photo et fait référence à une des heures de la Salat, à un découpage du temps quotidien qui est propre au monde musulman : Chorouk : 6h57, Dhor : 12h48, Asr : 16h04, Maghreb :18h40, Icha :19h41, par exemple, mais les heures varient en fonction des saisons et l’endroit où l’on se trouve

MONIKA / also, about hours, how does the place change as time passes, not physically, not the shadows, not light, but rather emotionally, i mean, the content of the place, its story?

MARIE / Indépendamment de l’appel à la prière qui fixe un sens et un déroulement à la journée au delà des apparences visibles. L’unité de temps de Bab-El-Louk est la journée. Comme dans le théâtre classique, la journée constitue le premier cycle temporel qui contient tous les autres, celui qui décrit tant le temps vécu et quotidien que le temps absolu qui régit le cours des choses. La série Bab-El-Louk est réalisé à la chambre 4X5inch, le temps d’exposition est long, dilaté, ralenti, le temps est une composante à part entière d’une grande partie de mes photos. Evoqué ou pris en compte dans le processus même de réalisation des images, il diffère du temps de la perception immédiate habituellement attaché à la photographie. La seule chose que je peux rajouter, c’est que ma maison d’enfance, est une maison analogue à celles que l’on voit dans cette série de photographies, elle a plusieurs toits terrasses qui sont pleins de tôles ondulées, de radios et TV qui marchent plus ou moins, de cages de pigeons peints de différentes couleurs (les pigeons, pas les cages), d’un vieux poster de Julia RobertS, une maison qui n’est pas au Caire mais à Alicante en Espagne..

BAB-EL-LOUK IMAGES BY MARIE BOVO
WE THANK FOR THE HELP TO EMMA FROM MARIE’S PARIS GALLERY KAMEL MENNOUR
ARTICLE BY MONIKA BIELSKYTE

THE ENTIRE ARTICLE CAN ONLY BE FOUND IN THE PRINTED EDITION OF SOME/THINGS MAGAZINE ISSUE001